Vanity Fair profiles The eXile: "Gutsy...visceral...serious journalism...abusive, defamatory...poignant...paranoid...and right!"
MSNBC: Mark Ames and Yasha Levine
Broke the Koch Brothers' Takeover of America
eXiled Alert! / March 8, 2009


Deep in your heart of hearts you know this day will come. It may come tomorrow or 10 years from now, but its coming is as inevitable as your funeral. The TV will go silent, the Internet will cease with a shudder, the police and army will vanish. Whatever the reason, our civilization as we know it will cease to exist and will be replaced by a makeshift barter economy filled with lawlessness, disease and ravenous humanity. Mad Max’s time will come, but there will be no pretty hero to save you.

Eventually, the situation may stabilize. But in the first few months, inaction will weed out the weak, the timid and the infirm. Whether you and yours survive depends only on you.

Your survival will depend on the tools you have at your disposal. A lot has been written about earthquake survival kits, flood survival kits, tornado survival kits and the like. Those articles contain great information on how much and what kind of provisions and tools to store, but none of them cover the tools and supplies that will really matter: firepower. Yes, the most important tool you can have in this type of situation is an appropriate firearm and a big supply of ammo. If you chose wisely, and your luck holds, you will live, perhaps long enough to see order restored. If you don’t, you will die.

The whole thing is simple, really. If you are to have only one firearm, make sure it is a reliable rifle in a potent caliber. A sidearm can prove very valuable, as it can be easily concealed and operated one handed, but a sidearm is inferior to the rifle in most other scenarios.

308 winchester round

The preferred caliber for your one weapon is .308 Winchester (7.61×51mm Nato). The .308 is a very common round and will be available long after the factories that make it are reduced to smoldering, empty rubble. Any local Walmart or Sportmart is likely to have crates of the .308 – just make sure getting additional ammo is on the top of your “shopping” list when the big day comes. But you’re better off stocking up well beforehand.

The ballistic characteristics of the .308 are excellent as well. It is accurate to 700 yards, has a fairly flat trajectory and has excellent stopping power. Some of you who know a thing or two about weapons may have read that the .223 is the best round for a modern rifle. It is, but not for the scenario we are considering. The .223 has less range than the .308 and its stopping power depends largely on using frangible ammunition. In a time of crisis, you have to be sure you rifle will protect you with any ammo you can get your hands on. And compared to the .308, the .223 is a highly specialized round, meant to ensure that a squad carrying M16 carries more ammo and can put more lead on target then a squad carrying AKs with a larger caliber ammo. Shot per shot, however, the situation changes.

The .308 round will incapacitate a zombie-size target with one well-placed shot, while a .223 is likely to require several rounds to put them down. In most states, it’s not even legal to hunt deer with the .223, because too many deer are just wounded, rather than killed, by the small bullet. If you can’t reliably kill a deer, what chance do you have against a pack of desperate people?

There are many rifles chambered in the .308, so the choice of the rifle should be dictated by its intended use. For dense urban environments, a semi-automatic rifle with 16-18 inch barrel length is preferable. This will assure the rifle is easy to handle in confined spaces and still maintains a 300-500 yard effective range. Some good choices are the AR-10/SR-25, M1A SOCOM 16, and the AK variants available in .308. The Springfield M1A is probably the best compromise between accuracy and reliability, but it is expensive, at over $1000. The AR-10 is highly accurate but requires a lot of maintenance, making it suspect as a survival rifle operated without access to gun-smiths.

Whatever rifle you chose, make sure it is equipped with iron sights and practice using them. A close-quarter battle optic like an Eotech maybe added, but keep in mind that it will require batteries, which do not last forever! Besides,  over-equipping a rifle makes it heavy and without transportation you will have to move around on foot. Remember, being mobile increases your tactical advantage – you want to survive!


If you live in a rural or otherwise sparsely populated area where you can see and identify targets at more then 500 yards, a bolt action .308 rifle is recommended. This rifle should have an 18-20 inch barrel to assure accurate hits up to 800 yards away and a robust scope system. Bolt action rifles are lighter then carbines, which is advantageous as there are greater distances to cover. The Scout rifle, invented by Jeff Copper, would be ideal. Its main distinction is a forward mounted scope, which allows the operator a wide field of view when not using the scope, and a quick transition to the scope when needed. Due to the forward placed scope, it can be used adequately in close-quarters, and also functions amazingly at long distances. Savage and Steyr make excellent Scout rifles.

Remember, acquiring tools is only the beginning. You must get proficient with whatever rifle you chose. More impotently, you must prepare mentally. You must imagine what will happen when the television tells you not to panic and then goes silent. Where will you go, what will you do? Make a mental list, practice the scenarios in your head. If you panic, you will die. Plan, prepare, stay calm and enjoy your imminent post-apocalyptic future! I can’t wait.

Read more:, Jack Mann, eXiled Alert!

Got something to say to us? Then send us a letter.

Want us to stick around? Donate to The eXiled.

Twitter twerps can follow us at


Add your own

  • 1. aleke  |  March 9th, 2009 at 2:15 am

    More. Seriously.

  • 2. Onan Zagreus  |  March 9th, 2009 at 2:40 am

    Very fucking sad guys. If you want real gun shopping advice there are millions of eschaton obsessed meat hunters whose opinions are based on experience killing animals with firearms rather than Russian gun porn and wikipedia.
    Advising neophyte survivalists to go for a bolt-action .308 because of it’s supposed ability to hit targets out to 800 yards is totally absurd, makes it clear that Mr. Mann has never shot a damn thing at 800 yards and is a poser twat.

    As far as the SHTF rifle goes, the clear choice is a Kalashnikov action in the original 7.62×39. Any make other than Romanian or Chinese. Or maybe a 12-gauge.

  • 3. Kotek Besar  |  March 9th, 2009 at 5:24 am

    Always remember to save 1 last round for every family member that you care about. Of course, with a .308, you will need to save fewer if you can get them to line up in a straight line.

  • 4. Kotek Besar  |  March 9th, 2009 at 5:24 am

    Always remember to save 1 last round for every family member or other person that you care about. Of course, with a .308, you will need to save fewer if you can get them to line up in a straight line.

  • 5. Ben  |  March 9th, 2009 at 5:24 am

    Heh. More impotently.

  • 6. Impotent  |  March 9th, 2009 at 6:14 am

    Sort of sums up the article. More impotently.

  • 7. Tommy Jefferson  |  March 9th, 2009 at 6:40 am

    Bull. My teenage daughters can easily pack 200 rounds of .223 all day long without breaking a sweat. Try that with .308

    I, my wife, and our two daughters each carry six 30-round magazines of .223 That’s 720 shots we can put into any gang of hoods in under a minute.

    The long-distance capabilities of .308 are useless for survival. This ain’t the WWI trenches of Verdun. This is suburban America where we will have militias and lines-of-sight rarely greater than three blocks.

    As a test, have a friend stand two football fields away and see if you could identify that person as friend or foe at 200 yards.

    Anyone who thinks they will be shooting people at ranges greater than 300 yards in a survival situation is a retard.

    More shots into more people is the name of the game.

  • 8. geo8rge  |  March 9th, 2009 at 7:40 am

    The problem with your analysis is that when the end times comes America will be ruled by war lords. Who will be the war lords? Not some pretender with a 308. Some combination of National Guard, Police and youth gangs. The rifle will just put you in possession of something others covet, and that you cannot defend. I advise accepting your new life as a serf (was your old life much better really) and learn to farm soybeans. And raise small rodents.

  • 9. thucydides  |  March 9th, 2009 at 7:44 am

    This is great; or would have been great around, say, a year ago, when one could easily obtain M1As or Savage Scouts or M14-style magazines from retail or online gun stores in the US.

    This reads like someone at Exiled finally woke up and noticed the Great American Gun Rush of 2008-09, and decided to write up some five hundred words paraphrasing the terabytes’ worth of material that has been posted and published in the past decade on survival and firearms.

    As advice to anyone who hasn’t seen enough material on this topic to make their eyes fall out, just Google for “best SHTF gun” and start reading. Forums, blogs, articles, books, there’s huge amounts of material available, including some by people who have actually tested their opinions in the field or against actual armed opponents.

    I don’t disagree with the “if you only get one rifle, get it in 7.62x51mm / .308WIN” argument, but that only really applies if you live in the US or a NATO ally country, you don’t have prior combat or marksman or hunting expertise with another gun, and if you’re going to take the time and effort to train and practice with it.

    By all means, go out and buy up what’s left on shelves and distribution warehouses of .308 rifles. Keep those factory employees working! :)

  • 10. Bored Teenager  |  March 9th, 2009 at 8:00 am

    What about the sks? While they aren’t 90 bucks anymore, it’s still the cheapest semi out there. Reliable as hell, and the round has enough power without much recoil.

  • 11. Kotek Besar  |  March 9th, 2009 at 9:18 am

    How I envy all you people who live in countries where rifles are legal and affordable. I can’t even buy a replica bb gun legally – the cops are afraid that people will use toy guns to stick up banks. Which is BS, because plenty of criminals stick up banks and commit other crimes with real guns. Guess my ass is toast come the apocalypse :(

  • 12. DrKiwano  |  March 9th, 2009 at 9:41 am

    I’m a fan of the SMLE myself. They were able to keep building the things within the material and labour contraints of late-WWII, fix them on the front, and they’re plenty accurate and reliable (e.g. they’re still used in patrols of the Canadian arctic because the Rangers don’t trust any other gun to keep working as well when the temperature falls to -40). There’s also a whole fuckload of them around that can be used for spare parts (since there was pretty much one built for every service-age man in the British Empire during WWII).

    .303 British is still a mighty popular cartridge (and there’s still a bunch of milsurp kicking around from WWII), but if you’re insistent on scoring something in 7.62 NATO, then there are plenty of Ishapore 2A1s kicking around in India (basically a SMLE rechabmered in 7.62 NATO, and with an extra 2 rounds of capacity in the magazine).

    The Mujahideen are also apparently fans of the design, and as known to (frequently) pass over AKs and SKSs in favour of a SMLE.

    Next week’s rant will be on the Moisin Nagant.

  • 13. wengler  |  March 9th, 2009 at 9:45 am

    A 12 gauge shotgun and a machete. A shotgun is an excellent weapon for home defense, and a machete is both intimidating and useful especially since it requires no ammunition. Any ideal defense plan would include making alliances with neighbors and having a wide assortment of weapons and ammunition available.

    Of course if it is your family against the world you might as well just invest in some rope to hang yourselves.

  • 14. happyhead  |  March 9th, 2009 at 9:46 am

    Losers have been hoping for the end of times for centuries. They want the slate wiped clean because they are, at heart, fuckups who can’t deal. And they hold all these revenge fantasies about guns and compounds and essentially rising to be overlord of some desert tribe. From Manson on down.

    Well guess what? It ain’t gonna’ happen. So go back to flipping burgers and don’t worry about guns. You aren’t going to need them.

    As long as there is television and fast food to keep the mass populace off the streets, there will never be even a hint of a class war.

  • 15. doctor k  |  March 9th, 2009 at 10:13 am

    even if this is meant as a heavy-handed parody of lame shit you find basement-dwelling idiots posting on arfcom it’s still not interesting. and if it was meant as an even semi-serious advice piece then I don’t know what to say. literally everything is incorrect haha

  • 16. aleke  |  March 9th, 2009 at 11:01 am

    Oh look… SO yeah, post more stories like this.

  • 17. 16 Shells from a 30.06  |  March 9th, 2009 at 11:05 am

    Mortar rounds are where the future’s at. Try advancing on my position with your hunting paraphernalia… be sure to act surprised when you you start catching high trajectory rounds lobbed at you from range. Odds are, you’ll never even see your enemy….much less shoot one.

  • 18. Chema Pino Suarez  |  March 9th, 2009 at 11:38 am

    I don’t see a Mad Max type future, though the it would be cool to watch fights in the Thunderdome. If there is a dystopic future depicted in cinema that seems like a possibility it is that of Children of Men. By that I mean the depiction of a highly militarized police state with many parts of the wold descending into violence not the infertile women part.

    There is nothing wrong with owning a gun. I also why many are put off by gun owners; many of them are dumb asses when it comes to politics; stupid Freeper types. Another thing I have noted about gun owners is that some of them are damn ugly; by that I mean some of the ugliest bipedal creatures to walk the earth. Like some fat fuck in XXXXL desert camo fatigues with a keffiyeh I saw at a gun show.

    I am liberal as hell: pro choice, pro-national health care and fiercely pro-labor.I am not one of those Corporatist pseudo-libertarian types that happens to own guns. For fucks sake there is a poster of the Haymarket Eight in my house. To liberals out there interested in owning guns don’t let the politics of many in pro-gun circles keep you from owning one.

    I own an semi-auto AK and it is ideal for SHTF scenario. Not a bad choice for a gun novice either, the AK was the first gun I ever shot. Simple as shit to as most of you have read and heard. I mean I am sure a guy with a lobotomy could maintain.

    For a SHTF weapon just make sure it is semi auto holds at least 20 rounds and uses a relatively common ammo type: 7.62×39, .308, and 5.56.

  • 19. Scott  |  March 9th, 2009 at 12:06 pm

    I also recommend that you file for your State’s concealed weapon license. In addition to not being hassled by the law, while law still exists, waiting periods do not typically apply for permit holders; an important tactical advantage for last minute shoppers.

  • 20. kertong  |  March 9th, 2009 at 1:23 pm

    If you’re going to be picking off targets at 800 yards, you definitely wouldn’t be doing it with the naked eye. Optics plays a key part in shooting anything 200+ yards and out, and identifying friend/foe won’t be as hard as you think.

    Do they swagger? drag limbs? look raggedy? It’s foe. Shoot! If you have a horde of say, 20 them approaching, I’d rather start picking them off at 500+ yds, than wait until they’re closer to 150yds to start.

    If you thought Mann referred to shooting all targets at 800 yards, with nothing but iron sights or a naked eye, then – I don’t know what to say to you.

    Also, “up to 800 yards” is important. It’s like having a gun – you hope to never use it, but when you need to, you’re glad to have it. I have a .223 AR15 myself, but if I could choose, I’d take a .223 AND a .308. It’s all about having the right tool for the right job.

  • 21. Cyclopat  |  March 9th, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    guitar strings, decks of playing cards, a Louisville Slugger/softballs+a few gloves and skunk seeds

  • 22. Dr. Luny  |  March 9th, 2009 at 1:45 pm

    The exiled had better not become a survivalist blog, that would just be sad. That said, I agree that a .308 rifle is the best weapon you could have for such a situation. Semi-auto would probably be preferable to bolt-action because it would let you lay down some useful covering fire, and it doesn’t have to be accurate out to obscene range, because let’s face it, unless you’re a trained shooter, you’re not going to be hitting anything at anywhere near the maximum range of these rifles. Where the .308 is superior to the .223 is increased stopping power, armor and cover penetration, and the ability to kill big animals like humans or deer. While the anti-rifle plate armor that the military uses is supposed to be able to stop a .308, it’s going to hurt alot more than a .223, and if the armor is old or cracked, or if the hit is in less than optimal conditions, a .308 might penetrate. It’s also nice to be able to shoot through cars, buildings, brick walls, and the like. In a survival situation a rifle should be useful for hunting, and as stated before, a .223 often just isn’t up to the task.

    And yes, in a total collapse of society survival would depend more on which gang of thugs you join than what weapon you carry. All these “Lone Wolf” survivalist types who think they’re going to be able to survive on their own, or with their nuclear family and a few friends are going to be massacred quite quickly.

  • 23. CVD  |  March 9th, 2009 at 3:01 pm

    I’m going to assume that if the shit hits the fan ill get my hands on a government issued AK-47 clone. Guess that conscript service was good for something.

  • 24. CeaseToExist  |  March 9th, 2009 at 5:17 pm

    This whole “Surviving the Apocalypse / UN black helicopter invasion / Islamo-fascist assault with my shitty rifle and strategic stockpile of canned beans” is so 90’s. With the stuff that’s coming down the pipeline such as directed-energy weaponry, you can pack a shotgun that spits out chainsaws for all that matters. You’re still fucked.

  • 25. Allen  |  March 9th, 2009 at 5:59 pm

    No gun is going to protect you when society crumbles; the first thing you’re going to want to do, as some folks say above, is try to join the local armed “militia” (or whatever they’re calling themselves). Otherwise, you probably want to hide … because flashing your rifle about around town will just result in some armed gang shooting you with *their* scoped rifles in order to steal it.

    Or maybe some other survivalist shoots you in the back for wandering into *his* territory armed.

    In other words a bit of the old solitary, nasty, brutish, and short…

  • 26. Mike Kalashnikov  |  March 9th, 2009 at 6:12 pm

    How about plans for homemade guns? 😉

  • 27. mechagodzilla  |  March 9th, 2009 at 6:19 pm

    Wow, it’s been a while since an article appeared that got flamed by the readers.

    This is one of those arguments (a long list) that can be argued all the way up to the limits of Godwin’s Law.

  • 28. Jim T.  |  March 9th, 2009 at 8:14 pm

    Got to hand it to the Russians, though. I can field-strip, clean and reassemble my SKS or my AK in less than five minutes. And I’m slow. I’ll be the one waiting for you to strut by my home with your M-16 or your AR-15.

  • 29. assmeister  |  March 9th, 2009 at 9:18 pm

    As a few people have mentioned, your best shot at survival in a “oh shit” scenario is joining the best armed group. You’d have to do horrible things to fit in, but that’s just the way it goes. It doesn’t matter much what weapon you have, just your willingness to use it and run with the pack.

    Anarchy wouldn’t last forever though. Some sort of authority is bound to assert itself rather quickly, so you should know how to recognize it and buddy up to it. If you’re smart enough to joint the most disciplined group, the chances are good that it’ll end up being the new authority. Which is good for you as you don’t have to change sides or anything. As somebody else said, the most successful groups would probably be a blend of ex-military and police. Don’t be dumb and joint some “student movement” or street gang. They’d burn out rather quickly, and you don’t wanna go down with them.

    Like the War Nerd says, war is about people, not hardware.

  • 30. j-dog  |  March 9th, 2009 at 10:16 pm

    Every nerd on the planet gets a huge boner to the thought of the “apocalypse.” But I guarantee you that IF this ever happens, the nerds will be the ones dying in the most hilarious (or HEROIC if you wanna speak their lang) ways.

    To “end of the world” nerds: there are millions of people who have more guns, more brains, more social skills, and are simply MORE RUTHLESS than you. Beat up and kill people NOW, because when shit gets wild you will not have a chance to live the fantasy.

  • 31. Nadezhda Krupskaya  |  March 9th, 2009 at 10:17 pm

    Is this ‘Jack Mann’ the Xenia cop, or somebody else, like, maybe Michael Jackson or Pee Wee Herman or the risen Koresh . . . ? Advice to all: practice the following mantra – “A wet dog does not bark at night.”

  • 32. Oksana  |  March 9th, 2009 at 10:30 pm

    Anyone seriously interested in surviving a crumbling society must already know this:

    I don’t see the point of the present eXiled article. If you want to cover this topic, do it properly. If not, why even start on it?

  • 33. Jacking off over my AK  |  March 10th, 2009 at 2:03 am

    For goodness sake, another fantasy survivalist post? Whenever I see on these types of articles something like “well, after careful analysis I have decided not to go with the 5.56mm…” , what I actually read is “I am jacking off all over my shiny AK”.

    Guns are cool, right? They look and feel f*cking awesome. But to pretend these f*cking awesome guns are some sort of substitute for you being a citizen in a complex society made up of various types of govt and laws, however imperfect they may be, is stupid.

    The only people winning here are the gun manufacturers, again.

  • 34. Fissile  |  March 10th, 2009 at 5:50 am

    .223 is ubiquitous among police/military forces now. The big problem with SHTF is that ammo will be one of the first things to disappear from the civilian supply channels. Your only source of ammo, in such a situation, will be from corrupt/dead cops/military personnel.

  • 35. Ed  |  March 10th, 2009 at 11:12 am

    I would suggest a new Saiga rifle in .308 for the best value for your money in .308. It can be modified to accept larger mags. For utility and cost, you can’t beat an SKS – true its accuracy over 300 yards is shit, but unless you live in open country, that will not be a real issue and you can buy 3 (give one to each member of your family or keep for parts) for every 1 expensive rifle you can buy. The 7.62×39 is about the cheapest and most available ammo around. If you need long range, buy a bolt action .308 with a real good scope or even day/night scope for over 300 yard action.

  • 36. nem  |  March 10th, 2009 at 11:31 am

    Better still, being that most western Europe readers don’t have access to legal weapons. how about a guide to buying in America and how to smuggle them in to Europe. buy a 7.62 or 9mm in the UK, yeah right.

  • 37. Chck Steel  |  March 10th, 2009 at 1:39 pm

    Me? I’m getting me a mohawk, a pair of assless leather chaps and painting a skull on the hood of my Hummer. Colt AR-15 M4, twin .45’s on tactical thigh rigs, a tomahawk, Bowie knife and a hand grenade medallion. Bring it on, bitches!

  • 38. J.T. Patton  |  March 10th, 2009 at 3:54 pm

    The best thing you can have when the lights go out? Clean drinking water, lots and lots of it. If you feel you need weapons to defend your water, get a bow and/ or crossbow. Learn archery skills. Learn to make your own arrows/ crossbow bolts. Gunfire just attracts unwanted attention. The same goes for smoke-build a solar cooker.
    Actually, the best thing you can do to ensure your survival is anything in your power to help keep civilization from failing in the first place!

  • 39. Michael G.  |  March 10th, 2009 at 10:21 pm

    I’d like to see the next article in this series be on forming and maintaining your own private militia. As the War Nerd so clearly illustrates in this week’s column, it’s never the hardware, it’s the ORGANIZATION.

  • 40. Delfosse  |  March 11th, 2009 at 9:33 pm

    Meh.. If you really want to survive that shit, a rifle won’t save your ass. To prepare yourself, you need to invest at least 20 grand. I explain…

    When the shit hits the fan, the thing you MUST do IMMEDIATELY is to skip town and get into unpopulated area, far from cities and villages, probably in some forest. The problem is that you won’t last long in there, that’s why you need lots and lots of stuff. You gotta buy it now, dig a hole somewhere in the forest, remember the exact spot and hide your junk in there. Enough junk to last 2 years. This amount of stuff will cost a lot.
    After 2 years you’re either dead or some form of government will appear.

    You also need to learn how to make traps with grenades. If you get caught, you must lead them into the trap instead of leading them to where your wife and children are. You’ll probably get killed, but at least you’ll be taking some of those motherfuckers with you.

    You’ll also have to build sort of a house in that forest once it all happens, so you need basic knowledge on how to do that.

    So all in all, you need to hide a huge amount of food, tools like an axe, some secondary stuff like toothbrush and cigarettes, seeds that you’ll plant, etc. If you’re smart, you can think of everything yourself. It’ll cost a lot.

    Also, when it happens, chicks tend to panic a lot. So a five across the face will calm your woman down. Children are smarter, they’ll be scared and do everything you say.
    Also don’t trust anybody or anything. A broken car and a sexy chick who asks for help – get away from there as fast as you can. It’s a trap.

    Good luck to you guys when it happens, I’ll die right away coz I don’t even have a gun.

  • 41. John Doe  |  March 12th, 2009 at 6:06 pm

    Ummm….guys? Mini-Glock tucked into the boot, capiche?

  • 42. Zykon-C  |  March 12th, 2009 at 10:42 pm

    Chile with 5X beans, chopped onions, jack cheese; pickled eggs; plenty of Kraut bier from any brewery south of Darmstadt. The result?


    You will be zombie-proof. Gua-raaan-teed. No one will come within 500 klicks.

  • 43. hz  |  March 15th, 2009 at 6:53 am

    what a load of shite. this is why the scene after katrina was such a fray

  • 44. hz  |  March 15th, 2009 at 6:57 am

    …because there are so many IDIOTS ready to turn into savages. did it never occur to ANY of you to take some responsibility for promulgating civility in the absence of the polis?

  • 45. Elmer  |  March 15th, 2009 at 7:55 am

    Go with 9mm so you can steal ammo off the bodies of dead Cuban paratroopers.


  • 46. Jeff  |  March 15th, 2009 at 9:04 am

    You guys are completely overlooking one of the most useful survival calibers out there, the .22lr. Silent enough to not give your position away when gathering meat for the table and also deadly accurate. You can buy a brick of 500 rounds for the price of a 20 round box of .308.
    Truth is, there isn’t any one caliber that will perform equally well in all scenarios.

  • 47. Newfie_Survivor  |  March 15th, 2009 at 9:24 am

    I think many of you are missing the point about the 308 rifle. In North America at least they are easy to get your hands on and there is a huge supply of ammo available. It is also a very reliable weapon that requires little maitenance. My grandfather still uses the same 308 rifle for moose hunting that he bought for $8 over fifty years ago. Nothing against the 223 but people with little firearms experience will find it harder to make a clean kill with the 223 as opposed to the more powerful 308. The 223 is a great caliber but it requires more precision shooting (unless you have a fully auto model with a ton of ammo). My uncle recently purchased a russion over/under that has a 223 and a 12 gauge shotgun. very effective gun for any scenario. For the 308 I’d prefer a semi with a mag myself, but a bolt action would do in a rural area as was stated in the article, although I don’t know how many newbies will be taking down “zombies” at 800 yards.

  • 48. Newfie_Survivor  |  March 15th, 2009 at 9:34 am

    I also agree with the post from Delfosse. If anything like a nuke or bio warfare goes down were all fucked anyway, especially those in cities. If you can try to get away into the wilderness where you might have a chance. I fear that many are in my situation. I live in a VERY rural area (on an island) and when the apocalypse comes goods will soon be cut off and we’ll be on our own, which is fine because we have a small population and enough resources to keep us fed. I’d love to stash away as much stuff as i’d need but my money goes to feeding my 3 kids and keeping the power on. I fear many people are in the same boat and when something happens we will be struggling to get our shit together. My simple plan is to slowly stockpile essentials at my rural cabin and try to get my family there as quick as i can. If it happens before 2012 i will not have much there but being a creature of the wilderness i know that we will survive as long as i have an axe.

  • 49. Jade  |  March 15th, 2009 at 10:50 am

    Interesting article, especially considering Osama.. er, Obama is working on outlawing many, if not most guns.

  • 50. Smoke  |  March 15th, 2009 at 3:55 pm

    As if we are all going to run in and hand over all our $1500 semi ARs. Obama starts outlawing guns the “collectors” will be getting them lead first.

  • 51. weak and faggy  |  March 15th, 2009 at 6:44 pm

    I’m going to be all weak and faggy when the SHTF. Because I figure one thing all those gunner tough guys are gonna need is a “girlfriend”.

  • 52. brian  |  March 15th, 2009 at 7:49 pm

    “More impotently, you must prepare mentally.”

    Um, don’t you mean importantly? :)

  • 53. Your daddy  |  March 16th, 2009 at 4:58 pm

    your all fools, death is not the enemy, give in, the other side is unlimited, this side is full of people like you.

  • 54. steve  |  March 16th, 2009 at 8:51 pm

    I live in the desert SW and Walmart is sold out every day. Phoenix received 7, 18 wheelers last week and sold out in one hour! They said they sold pallets to customers that never made it it inside….all pre-sold! When it happens it will be big, the financial is the beginning.
    I don’t think your better off with a gun than nothing. Just buy whats available, someone will want the ammmo and bullits can be used as money. Everyone say’s buy gold but I can hand over a once of gold if I just want to buy water of food. Bullets will be the best to trade foe.

    See ya on the other side!

  • 55. Ben  |  March 16th, 2009 at 10:02 pm

    A 762×39 or a .223 will serve most people much much better than a .308 will. In fact I would recommend a .22 for some people over any thing else. many people are still new to shooting and having some thing they are comfortable with is important. For all of the talk about stopping power, simply putting a hole in most people will persuade them to go seek medical attention asap.

  • 56. CSI  |  March 21st, 2009 at 10:47 pm

    Which type of gun helps you move out of your parents’ basement?

  • 57. Otis Driftwood  |  April 18th, 2009 at 5:56 am

    I have two Taurus 24/7 Pro’s that I carry in marine shoulder rigs, that gives me six 15 round clips, one in each weapon, and two in each clip carrier on the rig.
    I shoot a .22 rimfire, .308, a 35 remington, an AK and a Mac10.
    The wife and I have matching model 88 12 gauges, with extended magazines allowing 11 rounds to be carried
    I also shoot several pistols in competition.
    I have plenty of ammo and brass, I reload mty own ammo.
    I pity the fool who tries to get up my mountain when the walls fall down.

  • 58. Otis Driftwood  |  April 18th, 2009 at 6:00 am

    BTW my Taurus 24/7 pro’s are in 45ACP.
    And I can’t spell very well on day’s ending with y.

  • 59. badnewswade  |  April 24th, 2009 at 4:28 am

    Why not just get 7 different types of guns to cover every eventuality. That way you’d have a gun for every day of the week – plus a “best gun” for Sunday use!

  • 60. GunKnow  |  May 12th, 2009 at 12:47 am

    Have you tried buying 308 rounds lately? Nothing has collapsed yet but it is VERY hard to find 308s! Maybe black powder rifles are the way to go, and black powder is very easy to make.

  • 61. Charles  |  May 24th, 2009 at 6:32 pm

    You can use a .308 if you want, but anything, and I do mean any rifle will do. As far as ammunition, I would go with a 30-06, as there are by far more of them in existance than a 308. I only have one rifle, it is a 243, very, very popular caliber, extremely accurate, and I hand load, so no problem there. Personally, I think it will be more important to put food on a table, but who knows. So no matter what, if you are not capable of pulling a trigger, taking another life, you are in deep do-do. That being said, the fewer bleeding heart liberals left alive, the better off we will be, as it will be their fault anyway. Look at what they have done to us now. If it weren’t for the liberals we would not have had 9/11, or Osama Obama for that matter.

  • 62. Ryan  |  May 24th, 2009 at 10:17 pm

    If it wasn’t for religion we would not have had 9/11. This Liberal owns many guns and wouldn’t hesitate to shoot the brainwashed sheep that havent read a book in twenty years.

  • 63. Jack Boot  |  July 2nd, 2009 at 10:17 am

    Face it – anarchy is a young man’s game.
    I’m middle-aged, flabby and hypertensive – not a first-round militia draft pick.

    If civilization takes a swan dive, I’ll just hole up at home with protein bars, vodka and me trusty Lee-Enfield Jungle Carbine; with any luck I’ll take a few neo-Visigoths with me…

  • 64. Otis Driftwood  |  July 6th, 2009 at 3:43 am

    I’ll have a case of grenades and the 30 cal. M1 carbine please.

  • 65. Rob  |  January 21st, 2010 at 7:46 pm

    You can make a toy gun look as realistic as you want. The way you act and handle it is what makes it a weapon – even if it has no real bullets.

  • 66. Freightpilot  |  January 26th, 2010 at 12:56 pm

    As sad as the article is, what I find even more so are the fantasy scenarios posed by the people here. History is replete with examples of what happens when a government collapses. Some of which have happened fairly recently. I remember watching not to long ago as the Soviet Union met it’s demise. Learn a little history and then make factual decisions based in reality.

  • 67. whitehood  |  June 12th, 2010 at 6:20 am

    I agree that using 308 for a survival rifle, especially for a newbie borders on stupid. Ammo will always be available for the 5.56/223. Lets face it, you’re not going to be doing a lot of hunting for four legged animals with it. 223.5.56 is the way to go especially if you have good quality ammo like Black Hills 75 or 77 grain. Weight is also a factor. You can pick up a good quality AR 15/ M4 carbine clone at not much more than 6 pounds and 210 rounds of ammo is about 8 pounds. You’ll easily double that weight with a 308.7.62.
    Here’s Whitehood’s rec: Get a good quality flat top AR with a good set of back up iron sights and attach a good quality low power optical scope as your primary sight. Stay away from anything that needs batteries. Get a set of spare parts for the AR and at least a dozen good quality mags along with web gear. Then at least a thousand rounds of good ammo like Black Hills or Hornaday 75 to 77 grain ammo. Make sure your barrel twist is 1:9 if not faster in 1:7. THAT is a survival weapon.

  • 68. SlimJim  |  May 26th, 2012 at 6:24 pm

    I hate Winchester ammo. Call me an ass but nowadays all I shoot is Hornady.

  • 69. tan  |  October 15th, 2013 at 12:28 am

    I agree that using 308 for a survival rifle, especially for a newbie borders on stupid.

  • 70. Doc  |  March 1st, 2015 at 6:16 pm

    Nice Winchester Scout and Mini 14 pic… I remember taking them! They were pretty fun to shoot too. lol

Leave a Comment

(Open to all. Comments can and will be censored at whim and without warning.)


Required, hidden

Subscribe to the comments via RSS Feed