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Russia Babylon / February 15, 2010

yushchenko1

This article first appeared in The Nation.com...

If you’ve been wondering what ever happened to that wonderful Orange Revolution in Ukraine–because let’s face it, it was probably the last feel-good moment America collectively experienced in an otherwise bummer-packed decade–Sunday’s presidential elections in the former Soviet republic provided the answer: it went bad. Voters returned to power the same supposed villain, Viktor Yanukovych, whom they forced out in mass demonstrations the last time there presidential elections were held in 2004. The Orange Revolution’s leaders were overthrown by the same voters whom they empowered.

No politician suffered a more humiliating rejection than the former leader of that revolution and the current sitting president, Viktor Yushchenko–the pockmarked hero of the revolution who overcame a poisoning attempt on his life to lead the pro-democracy crowds to power in 2004. Yushchenko is so widely loathed that he was knocked out of the presidential race in the first round in January, receiving a mere 5 percent of the vote, or fifth place–one of the most embarrassing defeats by any sitting president in modern times.

Unfortunately for Ukrainians and for the region, we lost interest in that area after Yushchenko’s victory because for us, the revolution was less about improving the locals’ lives and more about boosting American exceptionalism’s wounded ego, which in 2004-2005 was at its rawest. Now it’s five years later, and “our guy” Yushchenko, whom we backed unquestioningly, turned out to be a colossal failure in every way imaginable–and his final moves in office may turn out to be his most destructive of all.

yushchenko_kiss

Last month, shortly after Yushchenko’s humiliating defeat in the first round of elections, he officially rehabilitated one of Ukraine’s most controversial WWII-era figures, the ultranationalist leader Stepan Bandera–a move so fraught with danger down the road that it’s as though he did it to punish his disloyal voters. Operating in the western region of Ukraine known as Galicia from the 1930s through the 1950s, Bandera’s military organization adopted typical fascist symbols and trendy racist ideas promoting ethnic chauvinism and racial purity to pursue its goal of creating an independent Ukrainian state.

The move sparked angry reactions from Jewish groups in Ukraine and abroad, as well as Russian-speaking Ukrainians and Poland, among others.

The Simon Wiesenthal Center, a leading Jewish human rights group named after the famous hunter of Nazis, sharply criticized Yushchenko’s move. “It’s a terrible signal to send, giving that kind of recognition to someone whose group cooperated with the Nazis, and whose followers were linked to the massacres of Jews,” said Mark Weitzman, the group’s US director of governmental affairs.

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47 Comments

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  • 1. Toshu  |  February 15th, 2010 at 2:47 pm

    In February 2008, Ukrainian Security Services (SBU) archive representative Oleksander Ishchuk showed declassified documents which provide an objective basis to state that OUN (the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists) is not connected with any violent actions against the civilian population of L’viv on or after July 4, 1941.

    The declassified documents of SBU indicate that from July 4-7, 1941, representatives of Gestapo who arrived in L’viv turned to the Ukrainian population, inciting them to carry out an anti-Jewish pogrom.

    “The OUN leadership, having got to know about that, informed its members that it was a German provocation in order to compromise Ukrainians with massacres,” the document reads.

    Prior to the German invasion, the Soviet NKVD, in which Jews had disproportionate membership, was involved in the killing of 4,000 to 8,000 civilian prisoners — a fact the Nazis hoped would provoke Ukrainian retaliation.

    Furthermore, while the Israeli Holocaust Museum Yad Vashem has also attempted to pin the L’viv Massacres on Ukrainians, especially Roman Shukhevych, leader of the Nachtigall battalion and later the anti-Nazi, anti-Soviet Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UPA), the head of the Association of Jewish Communities and Organizations of Ukraine, Vaad Yosyp Zisels, asked Yad Vashem for documentary evidence to prove that claim and was unable to obtain it.

    The Soviet investigation into the killing of L’viv’s Jews identified the “42 butchers of L’viv” responsible for the slaughter of the Jewish innocents in July of 1941. That list, compiled immediately after the Second World War and submitted to the Nuremberg military tribunals for prosecution, does not contain a single member of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists.

    If Stepan Bandera was even guilty of half the crimes of which Moskva and its ilk accuse him, then he would have been swinging from the gallows at Nuremberg 65 years ago.

    How strange it is that this author, so blindly ignores the wholesale Polish butchery of Ukrainian Lemkos and the massive destruction of their ancient churces, both Catholic and Orthodox (aided and abetted in this by their own Polish clergy) as described by the victims themselves in this document (click and copy the link, paste it into the address bar of your browser, and press Enter):

    http://bit.ly/aQYXXl

    Further analysis leads one to look up the Moment article about MAUP University. In it it clearly points a finger at Russian backing and possibly control of the MAUP and its anti-Semitic policies. The Russian FSB, Security Service is known to continue the Soviet policy of trying to discredit Ukrainians by using the false claims of anti-semitism, etc.

    Thankfully, the declassified KGB documents in Ukraine counter all of these anti-Ukrainian propaganda efforts if one looks beyond Wiki as a reference source.

  • 2. gyges  |  February 15th, 2010 at 3:54 pm

    There was a BBC documentary about 18-months ago where Berezovsky and Goldfarb explain how they bank rolled the Orange Revolution. I found it quite shocking when compared against the sincerity of the people who I know who supported the Orange Revolution. Sincere people committed to the status of chumps.

  • 3. Bollox  |  February 15th, 2010 at 5:41 pm

    This is all very interesting, but where’s the War Nerd?

    There’re still plenty of wars for him to get write about!

  • 4. napoleonkaramazov  |  February 15th, 2010 at 6:22 pm

    Great article.

    How funny, the Ukranians marching against the the Polish embassy, considering they are usually allied against the ‘evil Russians’.
    Ukranians certainly seem to have a victim complex.

    Also, what are the possibilities of the Ukranian territories breaking up. Perhaps that even might be the best option, considering that ‘Ukranian’ is essentially a recent identity.

  • 5. Jyp  |  February 15th, 2010 at 7:22 pm

    Wow! That is one ugly motherfucker! I mean it. And them goddamned NeoCons.. Jews almost to a man.. siding with that NeoNazi son of a bitch! Holy shit. This demonstrates what a cynical, soulless bunch of bastards they really are.

    But meanwhile, good to see Mark is getting some print action out and about these days. Great article. And the recent one in Alternet exposing those “Libertarian” fools.. another great article.

  • 6. calripson  |  February 15th, 2010 at 7:57 pm

    The Czechoslovakian solution is the only equitable and long term solution for Ukraine – partition into separate Western and eastern countries. Ukraine as currently constituted is a political fiction. As for Ames misguided attempt to portray the Ukrainians as antisemites, Toshu is correct: Ukraine is the model of racial acceptance from the days of Bogdan Khmelnitsky’s “No More Hate” campaign, to the Chernigov “Take Back the Night” pogroms of 1905, Ukrainians have done their part to make their Judaic neighbors feel welcome.

  • 7. FSB Agent 008  |  February 15th, 2010 at 10:04 pm

    Ukraine historically is one of the most anti-Semitic countries in the world, so nothing new in Yushchenko’s behavior. The Russian word “pogrom” migrated into English language as a shorthand for a burst of ethnic violence. It’s derived from often deadly anti-Jewish outbursts in czarist Russia, almost all of which took place in what today happens to be Ukraine.

  • 8. mydick  |  February 16th, 2010 at 1:46 am

    An excellent article that struck oddly close to home. My (Jewish) grandmother and her family lived in a suburb of L’viv before the war. She, her sister, and her parents left during the 1930′s, leaving a huge extended family behind, documented by family photographs and family trees. Every single one of them died between 1940 and 1945.

  • 9. rajagvu  |  February 16th, 2010 at 1:47 am

    Shalom,
    Because they are white racist,and how We proletarians know they are the evil of mankind white,women and man!!
    FSB A,
    “Ukraine historically is one of the most anti-Semitic countries in the world,..”
    We need replace them whit more Shelpless animals ,less white.If not this crackers,there would be place without racism and anti-semitism. want better world? You know what to do Proletarians;)

  • 10. Carlito  |  February 16th, 2010 at 4:48 am

    So instead of the full article reposted here we not get a teaser and a link? A sign of things to come?

  • 11. internal exile  |  February 16th, 2010 at 8:05 am

    I’m so burned out on charges of “anti-semitism” that I don’t believe them at all any more, and that means directed at anyone, by anyone.

  • 12. DERP  |  February 16th, 2010 at 11:39 am

    #9

    Why, it’s my favorite modern-day oxymoron: the racist “anti-racist”! Not exactly rare, not exactly brilliant, but there’s something to be said for mindless, self-serving stupidity.

    Also, I’m with internal exile. Anti-semite this, anti-semite that. Just whatever.

  • 13. kokhanovski  |  February 16th, 2010 at 1:03 pm

    @7

    “pogrom” translates as “devastating victory” (before being hijacked by the zionist crowd). It is seen applied to both Cossack and Polish victories against each other in the centuries-long wars over eastward Polish colonization, in the old chronicles. More recently, in the 19th century, conflicts arose in what is now White Russia and Ukraine when the remaining Polish-held manors started being expropriated for “disloyalty” during the Napoleanic, and Turkish wars. Jews were strongly attached to these remnants of Polish nobility and frequently quite hostile to the “Provoslanvyi Narod” ie peasantry. There are numerous accounts of feuds and butcheries between neighboring villages of jews and “chrestiani” (aka serfs) with many of these being initiated by the jews, to recover their eloped hottie daughters, or unpaid debts, for example.

    @8 my extended family which counted upwards of a hundred in 1941, ceased to exist except for my parents, in 1945.

  • 14. Diet Coke  |  February 16th, 2010 at 4:25 pm

    What’s with the sudden persecution of fascism? Aren’t Dolan and Brecher fascists?

  • 15. Ilona  |  February 16th, 2010 at 7:02 pm

    Deep words of wisdom!

    Goes to show democracy doesn’t work no matter what. Strange enough, not even in the ex-Soviet state of Ukraina. Eh… What? It works? Oh yeah, but only in the USA. Poor Ukrainians the USA lost their interest for the territorial pissing ground. They’ll most likely die of bordom. Who’s going to humor them next from now on? Woody Allen? Or once again some master gay race dressed to kill with their highly sophisticated and effective industrial – blueprints stolen from the British Imperium and General Motors – happy chicken poultry farms?

    Hopefully the USA’ll find more seductive G-spots elsewhere. ASAP. We need our daily news feed fresh! There must be some isolated islands somewhere in the world where the bull feather merchants are most desperately needed. Perhaps Faroe Islands? Some up to no good goats there with their unholy goat oath pagan ways. Nay… Too demanding. And utterly boring. Erase that. For fuks sake! Goats with the bull feather mercs! Nooo! Need weird chicks with huuuge guns for lust for life of others from some 3rd world nation. Da!

    A nice mixed pack of revolution, democracy, politics, religion, hatred, WWII miniatures and artifacts, cool cars and sagging flat butts though. Keep on the good work Mark!

    Hail the almighty Russian penises and their potent seed!

    Ps. Could there be a bit more ethnic clensing going on in this article and below it? Because that’s exatcly what the whole world has been engaged in since who know’s when. The whities this and the whities that! Please, give some credit for other races as well in the massive operation for the pursuit of happiness.

    1930s? 1940s? Pretty decent decades in the worldwide blood sports and close enough for us to remember. And to learn from: the work human race knows how to do best. Sucking, fucking and killing. Much, much more of the same old is yet to come, but in much larger scale in the form of global warming, overpopulation, lack of clean water, food shortage, energy shortage, not so chubby chicks, limb dicks… Sucking, fucking and killing.

    A heavenly dream for the Gryonic War Nerd!

  • 16. Plamen Petkov  |  February 17th, 2010 at 6:51 am

    When we are talking about Jews are we talking about the REAL Semitic people who lived in the areas of the Middle East 2000 years ago or are we talking about the fake Ashkenazi “Jews” here who happen to be decedents of the Khazars?
    Frankly, I am sick and tired of hearing bout the prosecution of the so called “Jews” when there have been many other Holocausts in the 20 century itself. How long will the “Jews” exploit the Holocaust™ to their benefit? The Annie Frank’s “dairies” have been proven fake, the famous sign at the concentration camp was changed from “6 million” to “about 1.5 million” and so on. Enough already!
    Why are we turning an interesting election story yet again about “the Jews” and their suffering?

  • 17. Brendo  |  February 17th, 2010 at 2:09 pm

    #15 I see you left the crazy filter off today!

    As rants go it was impressive. A little unfathomable in places and not very coherant, but passionate.

    That’s what the crowds love!

  • 18. Ontherag Dikshit  |  February 17th, 2010 at 9:34 pm

    Yes, there really is a dude named ontherag dikshit: look it up.

    So many of the GPU agents and ‘activists’ who murdered 7-13.5 million Ukrainians during the 1932-33 terror famine were Jewish; over half of all secret policemen, in some areas. Is it so surprising that there were bad feelings for Soviet Jews after that? And only a small fraction of Ukrainians served the Germans to kill Jews during the Holocaust: far more served in the Red Army.

    And if you had been a Ukrainian man captured by the Germans while serving in the Red Army, and had been given a choice between serving as a camp guard, or starving to death as a POW, what would you have done?

  • 19. Ilona  |  February 17th, 2010 at 11:21 pm

    @ 17. Crazy? No. A rant? No. Unfathomable? No. Incoherent? No.

    Color me impressed as well!

  • 20. mydick  |  February 17th, 2010 at 11:48 pm

    @16 Go back to your 0-comment freak “blog,” you “ass clown” and blame “the Jews” for ruining your pathetic “life.”

  • 21. truth  |  February 18th, 2010 at 12:33 am

    8

    Let’s see here the article is all wrong.

    1) He was not poisoned he went on a drunken bender and got food poisoning which he and his Bandera/Reagonite wife sent the blood samples which were tampered with in the US with were used a proof of poisoning.

    2) He was installed into power in a western funded and backed coup financed by Soros/NED/British Foreign office NGO’s with his specific purpose to wreck the Ukrainian economy and relations with Russia sabotaging oil and gas transit to the EU.

    http://www.idc-europe.org/showerInformation.asp?Identificateur=29

    3) Starting in 2000 following Putin’s lead Kuchma started to work against the Oligarchs and IMF economic policy and the GDP year after year improved until the coup of 2004.

    4) Yushchenko is the former director of the Central Bank of Ukraine who implemented the disastrous IMF/Soros reforms and set up a political party to secure and maintain transit company rights to Russian oil and gas to Europe.

    5) Remember he along with the other Soros puppet in George launch the war against South Ossetia and Abkhazia as well in conjunction with Mossad smuggling Ukrainian weapons to US/British/Israeli backed rebels in Darfur.

  • 22. truth  |  February 18th, 2010 at 12:34 am

    @Toshu

    You do know the CIA/MI6 recruited, gave sanctuary and help train Ukrainian nationalist and other Nazi affiliated towards the end of WW2.

    http://www.voltairenet.org/article30079.html

    Is this reliable as there evidence of the man-made Holodomor Ukrainian famine hoax?

    http://chss.montclair.edu/english/furr/vv.html

    http://www.rationalrevolution.net/special/library/famine.htm

    Seeing how they have help from the US state department we can question there authenticity that they are not WW2 or Cold War era forgeries inserted into the archives.

    Of course like in other East European countries killing of Jews were reprisals against Jewish Communist NKVD Jews some of the most senior war criminal working at Yad Vasham in Tel Aviv.

    http://www.jewishtribalreview.org/russiantears.htm

    What is wrong with MAUP University it is credited as being one of the best in Europe?

  • 23. truth  |  February 18th, 2010 at 12:35 am

    @FSB Agent 008

    If you were Ukrainian wouldn’t you be so called anti Semitic? Jewish Communism, Oligarchs, white sex slavery, “Russian” mafia, etc.

    Europe and the Zionist colony US are becoming increasingly anti-Semitic and when the Jewish banking firms totally collapse along with civilisation it will be the time of Jacob’s troubles.

  • 24. Ilona  |  February 18th, 2010 at 9:55 am

    @ 21. So true! So true!

    She told me all this while she was sucking him off. For the record: he was quite nicely drunk, wasted and passed out. I was having a nice cup of tea. He’s a good drunk. No attitude and shit. Butt ugly face thou, she said. It’s all because of his drunken binges.

    I reckon that’s why she – him being all wasted and passed out – had the nerve to tell me all those hard facts you mentioned. And some more.

  • 25. root  |  February 18th, 2010 at 12:50 pm

    You’re a disgusting creature Ames.

  • 26. Hon Kee Mufo  |  February 18th, 2010 at 1:14 pm

    hey ames when you gonna follow up on the anthrax attacks?

    you don’t wanna live forever do you?

  • 27. Ilona  |  February 18th, 2010 at 5:58 pm

    @ 26.

    …and when you are going to follow up your moniker?

    Shiit! Hon Kee Mufo! Where ever you end up… Good luck!

  • 28. homer  |  February 18th, 2010 at 6:35 pm

    I don’t blame him for being a little shit … I mean just look at him. He was one pizza face’d kid, I’d bet

  • 29. Old fan  |  February 18th, 2010 at 7:12 pm

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=a75BfbH3Vyhw&pos=12

    Mark, does this bring back memories?

  • 30. Russian Dude  |  February 19th, 2010 at 1:30 am

    Yushenko helped embezzle over 2 billion from Ukraine. Can Yanukovich sue Yushenko and send him to the Gulag? Yanukovich will be president soon. Yushenko wanted to imprison Yanukovich for election rigging, just imagine how bad it’s going to be for jacking 2 billion. And that’s a shitload of money for Ukraine, enough to actually get their economy going. Time to open up Yushenko’s Swiss Bank account!

    And Toshu, did it ever come across your “brilliant” mind, that some “people” might fake facts to make countries fight over petty nationalism? Like in Yugoslavia?

    BTW, enough with the Ukrainian and Russian and Jewish bashing. Petty Nationalism brought nothing but corporate fucktards, disaster and poverty to former USSR countries, when will you people learn? Look at how many medals USSR won at the Olympics? How are all of you guys doing? Wait, hang on, tiny Norway is about to win again. But you can keep on fighting about petty nationalism, instead of real issues, like putting bread on the table for your fellow countrymen.

  • 31. burt  |  February 19th, 2010 at 2:22 am

    Mark,
    I want to tell you that in all the times I’ve posted comments anonymously, I can proudly say that I never once made a grammatical mistake. Someday I will get a star for this, and then you’ll see who’s the smart guy. Meanwhile…can I have your autograph?

  • 32. Black Monk  |  February 19th, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    I’m surprised nobody caught the irony of Ames, on the one hand, justifying school or work shootings caused by bullying or having to work in a cubicle, while being all outraged – OUTRAGED! – that some Ukrainians having experienced real persecution (not the kind suffered by spoiled, whiny unsuccessful corporate drones) slaughtered a few 10,000s of people. Bandera’s crimes were disgusting but Ames seems to be the last person to have the right to complain about them.

    I guess Ames’ real problem was that Bandera succeeded magnificently in what he wanted to accomplish while Ames only likes losers.

  • 33. Black Monk  |  February 19th, 2010 at 2:58 pm

    @14: Ames apparently only likes losers. Bandera succeeded in ethnically cleansing Ukraine of 100,000s of Poles, his dream of an independent Ukraine is reality, his statues have gone up in the heart of formerly Polish towns, etc. etc.

    When it comes to violent fascists, the Exiled staff only prefer Limonov types who got nothing to show for their efforts but bruises from when the cops beat them down.

  • 34. Black Monk  |  February 19th, 2010 at 3:09 pm

    One more comment: Bandera’s organization was fascist, anti-Polish and anti-Communist but not antisemitic. One of his top helpers, Richard Yary (wikipedia that name) was of Jewish-descent and married to a Jewish woman, as were some others working for him.

    Bandera was amoral and willing to help kill Jews for the Germans if doing so would be the price to be paid for Bandera to accomplish his goals, but that is not the same as his being antisemitic. When the Nazis and Bandera turned on each other, Bandera’s people ended up saving a lot of Jews (while killing others).

    As for pogroms – they are initiated by Russian tsarist nationalists in Ukraine. Those would be Yanukovich’s modern-day supporters. Pogrom isn’t even a Ukrainian word.

  • 35. Kotovsky  |  February 20th, 2010 at 9:59 am

    @34: Give us a “Ukrainian” word, which is not also either Russian, or Polish, or Yiddish or English.

  • 36. truth  |  February 21st, 2010 at 5:32 am

    @Black Monk

    “As for pogroms – they are initiated by Russian tsarist nationalists in Ukraine. Those would be Yanukovich’s modern-day supporters. Pogrom isn’t even a Ukrainian word.”

    The so called pogroms were engineered by Jewish Marxist terrorists groups themselves residing in the Pale of Settlement or reaction to incidents of acts of terrorism in Russia organised and based in the PoS and local reactions to Jewish group behaviour Usury, sex trafficking, etc and the fact that one of the largest pogrom in Ukraine or as it was then the PoS more non-Jews died then Jews.

  • 37. Black Monk  |  February 21st, 2010 at 8:14 pm

    @35 – “Horilka.” Or “hroshi.” Or “zozulia.” Now give us a “Russian” word, that is not also Ukrainian, Polish, French, Church Slavonic, Tatar or Mongol

  • 38. Kotovsky  |  February 22nd, 2010 at 10:36 pm

    @37 – Let’s check Polish dictionary, shall we?

    gorzała, gorzałka
    «wódka»

    grosz
    «setna część złotego»
    «pewna suma pieniędzy»
    «dawna moneta o różnej wartości»

    zazula, zozula
    «kukułka»

    Chłopiec, zawsze najpierw poszukaj w słowniku polskiej mowy.

  • 39. Russian Dude  |  February 24th, 2010 at 1:16 am

    @ Black Monk of the Dark Ages:

    If you take a look at Russia’s history, you’d find that Russians came from a intermarriage of Russes, (hence Rus, land of Russes,) and Slavs. Novgorod is mentioned as a “New City”, the name Nov Gorod, or novuy gorod, means New City in Russia, around 862 AD. Kiev was annexed to Russia in 882 AD, and remained part of the Russian Culture, until the Mongol Invasions. Novgorod’s men constantly kept the Kievans in check, be they led by Oleg, or St. Vladimir.

    Under early Russian rule, Kiev enjoyed a fair degree of autonomy, that was stolen from Kievan Rus, as a result of the Mongol invasions, and the Polish capitalizing on these invasions. Later on, the Russians took Kiev back from the Poles. With the Mongol-Polish exception, Kiev was a part of the Russian Empire for a millinea.

    At the end of World War I, the Communists took over Russia, and signed a disastrous treaty, which ceded Russian land to Germany. But Germany lost the following year, so a new country was to be born, called Ukraine, as the Anglo-French forces, in order to thank Russia for assistance, didn’t want to give Russians, Russian land back. With friends like these, who needs enemies?

    Ukraine was taken back within a few decades. Stalin created Ukrainian SSR in order to have another vote in the United Nations. But after the fall of the Soviet Union, Ukraine, swept up in a fervor of nationalism, gained independence. And what did this indepedence do for Ukraine?

    Hunger, desease and poverty. While denouncing Holodomor, Yushenko drove his country to such heights of poverty, that villagers had to become hookers to avoid starvation. So Black Monk, excuse me, but I am going to be spitting on your bullshit “history”.

    Bandera succeeded because he fought when the Wehrmacht and the Red Army were tied up elsewhere. “Yeah, Bandera was such a bad ass when fighting women an children, he should pat himself on the back for his efforts”/sarcasm.

  • 40. Black Monk  |  February 24th, 2010 at 8:01 am

    @38 – Horilka and gorzala are two different words. Or are they the “same” to you because they share the same Slavic root. You may be amazed by the fact that Slavic languages have the same roots to their words, just as Romance languages do to their words (such as the different words grazzi and gracias for thank you in Italian and Spanish, respectively). Why does it surprise you that the Slavic Ukrainian language has words with roots similar to those of other Slavic languages? I asked you what words exist in Russian that do not exist in Polish, Ukrainian, Mongolian, Tatar or Church Slavonic. You did not answer. Maybe because there are none? While we’re at it, what words are there in Polish that are not also Czech or Russian or Ukrainian? (French or Latin borrowings don’t count). I guess by your logic there are no seperate languages at all.

    @39 – Ukrainian SSR was created long before Stalin, it was Lenin’s idea as a way of appeasing Ukrainians enough to consolidate Soviet rule over them (give em paper autonomy and cultural autonomy while we get a grip on the military/police situation). If Hitler were smarter, like the Bolsheviks, he would have done the same thing. This is basic history, you ought to have known it.

    Ukraine’s economic free fall was in the 1990′s, before Yushcehnko’s presidency. That’s when all the whores went from Luhansk to Moscow. Didn’t you read the exile? As for Bandera, you seem to think I’m his fan or something, when I’m not. I’m just calling out Ames’ hypocrisy for his outraged article about the man.

  • 41. Black Monk  |  February 24th, 2010 at 8:07 am

    Briefly, @38, zozula is not a Polish word. Just use google translate, it gets nothing.

  • 42. Black Monk  |  February 24th, 2010 at 12:51 pm

    @ Russian Dude, you wrote “Bandera succeeded because he fought when the Wehrmacht and the Red Army were tied up elsewhere. “Yeah, Bandera was such a bad ass when fighting women an children, he should pat himself on the back for his efforts”/sarcasm.”

    In addition to killing women and children during the war, in the 1930′s Bandera’s university student volunteers killed the Polish interior minister, a bunch of Polish and Ukrainian moderates, the Soviet consil to Lviv, they pulled off a few spectacular bank heists to fund their activities, burned Polish estates to the ground, and otherwise pulled off things that Limonov’s followers could only dream of.

    During the war, of course, in addition to massacring civilians Bandera’s guerrillas also killed Soviet Marshal Vatutin (who died of his wounds after a Banderist ambush) famous Soviet superspy Kuznetsov, a Polish communist interior minister, etc.

    I don’t like fascist thugs and the killing of civilians, I find that repulsive. But I insist that it is ridicukus for those who seems to appreciate Russian fascist thug Limonov and/or who defend the killing of unarmed schoolkids in Columbine to pretend to be outraged by the likes of Bandera.

  • 43. Kotovsky  |  February 24th, 2010 at 10:59 pm

    @41:

    http://pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/zazula

    In the nutshell, the same applies to “horilka” and other words appropriated and mangled by upwardly mobile Galician subjects of Polish landlords in their attempts to separate themselves from ranks of the great unwashed.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creole_language

    Then it was left to the likes of Grushevsky and Co to consciously push it as far as they could while serving their Austrian masters and to the bolsheviks to attempt to ram this nonsense down the throat of the vast majority of the population.

    And by the way, before deflecting this with another platitude about the evils of Russian linguistic oppression, please do look up the history of Occitan in French Provence to see how the civilized countries dealt with the proliferation of patois dialects on their territory.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vergonha

  • 44. FrankMcG  |  February 25th, 2010 at 12:41 am

    That poison is scary shit =(

  • 45. Black Monk  |  February 25th, 2010 at 11:08 am

    @43 The flaw in your argument is that the same principles can be applied to the Russian language, which in a Kotovskian sense can be understood as a creole derived from patching together northern dialects (“mangled” Ukrainian?), Church Slavonic, borrowings from French and from the mongol and tatar masters. Indeed, this can be applied to any language at all – Czech is mangled Polish with mangled German words added, Italian as mangled Spanish (or vice versa), English as a hybrid of mangled French and mangled German with Latin borrowings, etc. etc. How do you decide which is “mangled” and which is “real?”

    FYI the Ukrainian language was mostly developed by petty gentry from eastern Ukraine (people from Hohol’s social class, but a generation later – I’m deliberately avoiding the mangled version of his surname). Do many Russians in need of maintaining their superiority vis a vis Ukrainians cling to the stories you do?

  • 46. Jay  |  March 3rd, 2010 at 5:10 am

    The Russians, er, Soviet Union, signed a pact with the Nazis. Does that make them Nazis??

    Ames, you can’t be all Gary Brecher and gleeful about the brutality of war one minute and then all, “(Gasp!) people were killed!” the next. It was a brutal time in a brutal region, where nations rubbed against each other like tectonic plates lubed with peasants’ blood.

    Bandera will come to be known and recognized as the George Washington or Tom Jefferson of Ukraine, just wait a few decades. Certainly there would be no independent Ukraine today if it weren’t for Bandera and UPA.

  • 47. Ukraine Escort  |  August 6th, 2010 at 4:26 am

    This was a shame on all of us. A horrible act committed by cowards. Russian intelligence was most definitely behind this. These are the neocons I assume. They’re very bad men. :-/


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